How common is the “elliptical dual” (or plural) cross-linguistically?











up vote
1
down vote

favorite
1












This question on Latin.SE asks about the "elliptical dual", a construction where the dual number doesn't mean "two X" but instead "X and one other". For example, in the Iliad, Aíant-e Ajax-DUAL means not "the two Ajaxes" but "Ajax and Teucer".



Similarly (from the answers and comments on that question):




  • Sanskrit ahanī day-DUAL "day and night"

  • Latin Castor-ēs Castor-PLURAL "Castor and Pollux"

  • Arabic al-qamarāni the-moon-DUAL "the sun and moon"


From my rudimentary knowledge, Japanese also seems to have a similar construction: Yuki-chan-tachi Yuki-DIM-PLURAL "Little Yuki and her friends".



I'm curious how widespread this phenomenon is. In English we don't seem to use the plural like this, but are we the outliers? Some of the examples here seem to come from Proto-Indo-European, but Arabic and Japanese certainly don't.










share|improve this question


























    up vote
    1
    down vote

    favorite
    1












    This question on Latin.SE asks about the "elliptical dual", a construction where the dual number doesn't mean "two X" but instead "X and one other". For example, in the Iliad, Aíant-e Ajax-DUAL means not "the two Ajaxes" but "Ajax and Teucer".



    Similarly (from the answers and comments on that question):




    • Sanskrit ahanī day-DUAL "day and night"

    • Latin Castor-ēs Castor-PLURAL "Castor and Pollux"

    • Arabic al-qamarāni the-moon-DUAL "the sun and moon"


    From my rudimentary knowledge, Japanese also seems to have a similar construction: Yuki-chan-tachi Yuki-DIM-PLURAL "Little Yuki and her friends".



    I'm curious how widespread this phenomenon is. In English we don't seem to use the plural like this, but are we the outliers? Some of the examples here seem to come from Proto-Indo-European, but Arabic and Japanese certainly don't.










    share|improve this question
























      up vote
      1
      down vote

      favorite
      1









      up vote
      1
      down vote

      favorite
      1






      1





      This question on Latin.SE asks about the "elliptical dual", a construction where the dual number doesn't mean "two X" but instead "X and one other". For example, in the Iliad, Aíant-e Ajax-DUAL means not "the two Ajaxes" but "Ajax and Teucer".



      Similarly (from the answers and comments on that question):




      • Sanskrit ahanī day-DUAL "day and night"

      • Latin Castor-ēs Castor-PLURAL "Castor and Pollux"

      • Arabic al-qamarāni the-moon-DUAL "the sun and moon"


      From my rudimentary knowledge, Japanese also seems to have a similar construction: Yuki-chan-tachi Yuki-DIM-PLURAL "Little Yuki and her friends".



      I'm curious how widespread this phenomenon is. In English we don't seem to use the plural like this, but are we the outliers? Some of the examples here seem to come from Proto-Indo-European, but Arabic and Japanese certainly don't.










      share|improve this question













      This question on Latin.SE asks about the "elliptical dual", a construction where the dual number doesn't mean "two X" but instead "X and one other". For example, in the Iliad, Aíant-e Ajax-DUAL means not "the two Ajaxes" but "Ajax and Teucer".



      Similarly (from the answers and comments on that question):




      • Sanskrit ahanī day-DUAL "day and night"

      • Latin Castor-ēs Castor-PLURAL "Castor and Pollux"

      • Arabic al-qamarāni the-moon-DUAL "the sun and moon"


      From my rudimentary knowledge, Japanese also seems to have a similar construction: Yuki-chan-tachi Yuki-DIM-PLURAL "Little Yuki and her friends".



      I'm curious how widespread this phenomenon is. In English we don't seem to use the plural like this, but are we the outliers? Some of the examples here seem to come from Proto-Indo-European, but Arabic and Japanese certainly don't.







      morphology list-of-languages grammatical-number plurality






      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question











      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question










      asked 6 hours ago









      Draconis

      8,6641034




      8,6641034






















          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes

















          up vote
          4
          down vote













          Since there are more languages with dedicated plural forms than there are with dedicated dual forms, this phenomenon is probably more common with plurals. I'm more familiar with constructions like Japanese "-tachi" being called "associative" plurals: there is a WALS chapter about this grammatical feature ("The Associative Plural", by Michael Daniel and Edith Moravcsik) which indicates that it is actually relatively widespread. Some languages have a distinct form used for associative plurals, but this appears to be less common.






          share|improve this answer





















          • @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
            – Alex B.
            1 hour ago













          Your Answer








          StackExchange.ready(function() {
          var channelOptions = {
          tags: "".split(" "),
          id: "312"
          };
          initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

          StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
          // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
          if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
          StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
          createEditor();
          });
          }
          else {
          createEditor();
          }
          });

          function createEditor() {
          StackExchange.prepareEditor({
          heartbeatType: 'answer',
          convertImagesToLinks: false,
          noModals: true,
          showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
          reputationToPostImages: null,
          bindNavPrevention: true,
          postfix: "",
          imageUploader: {
          brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
          contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
          allowUrls: true
          },
          noCode: true, onDemand: true,
          discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
          ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
          });


          }
          });














          draft saved

          draft discarded


















          StackExchange.ready(
          function () {
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2flinguistics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f29893%2fhow-common-is-the-elliptical-dual-or-plural-cross-linguistically%23new-answer', 'question_page');
          }
          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown

























          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes








          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes








          up vote
          4
          down vote













          Since there are more languages with dedicated plural forms than there are with dedicated dual forms, this phenomenon is probably more common with plurals. I'm more familiar with constructions like Japanese "-tachi" being called "associative" plurals: there is a WALS chapter about this grammatical feature ("The Associative Plural", by Michael Daniel and Edith Moravcsik) which indicates that it is actually relatively widespread. Some languages have a distinct form used for associative plurals, but this appears to be less common.






          share|improve this answer





















          • @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
            – Alex B.
            1 hour ago

















          up vote
          4
          down vote













          Since there are more languages with dedicated plural forms than there are with dedicated dual forms, this phenomenon is probably more common with plurals. I'm more familiar with constructions like Japanese "-tachi" being called "associative" plurals: there is a WALS chapter about this grammatical feature ("The Associative Plural", by Michael Daniel and Edith Moravcsik) which indicates that it is actually relatively widespread. Some languages have a distinct form used for associative plurals, but this appears to be less common.






          share|improve this answer





















          • @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
            – Alex B.
            1 hour ago















          up vote
          4
          down vote










          up vote
          4
          down vote









          Since there are more languages with dedicated plural forms than there are with dedicated dual forms, this phenomenon is probably more common with plurals. I'm more familiar with constructions like Japanese "-tachi" being called "associative" plurals: there is a WALS chapter about this grammatical feature ("The Associative Plural", by Michael Daniel and Edith Moravcsik) which indicates that it is actually relatively widespread. Some languages have a distinct form used for associative plurals, but this appears to be less common.






          share|improve this answer












          Since there are more languages with dedicated plural forms than there are with dedicated dual forms, this phenomenon is probably more common with plurals. I'm more familiar with constructions like Japanese "-tachi" being called "associative" plurals: there is a WALS chapter about this grammatical feature ("The Associative Plural", by Michael Daniel and Edith Moravcsik) which indicates that it is actually relatively widespread. Some languages have a distinct form used for associative plurals, but this appears to be less common.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 2 hours ago









          sumelic

          8,07111744




          8,07111744












          • @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
            – Alex B.
            1 hour ago




















          • @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
            – Alex B.
            1 hour ago


















          @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
          – Alex B.
          1 hour ago






          @Draconis note the use of the term "associative" (the default term) vs. "elliptical" (used only once, Delbrück 1893).
          – Alex B.
          1 hour ago




















          draft saved

          draft discarded




















































          Thanks for contributing an answer to Linguistics Stack Exchange!


          • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

          But avoid



          • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

          • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


          To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.





          Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.


          Please pay close attention to the following guidance:


          • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

          But avoid



          • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

          • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


          To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




          draft saved


          draft discarded














          StackExchange.ready(
          function () {
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2flinguistics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f29893%2fhow-common-is-the-elliptical-dual-or-plural-cross-linguistically%23new-answer', 'question_page');
          }
          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown





















































          Required, but never shown














          Required, but never shown












          Required, but never shown







          Required, but never shown

































          Required, but never shown














          Required, but never shown












          Required, but never shown







          Required, but never shown







          Popular posts from this blog

          flock() on closed filehandle LOCK_FILE at /usr/bin/apt-mirror

          Mangá

          Eduardo VII do Reino Unido